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The Minolta CLE is compact. Its telemetric base is reduced, therefore the rangefinder window is nearly upon the optical axis, close to the top of lenses. The Rokkor CLE lenses (28, 40 and 90 mm) have been designed with this compactness in mind. The Leica M lenses and especially their sunshades are likely to block the sight in the viewer, or, worse, the window of the rangefinder, having focusing impossible.
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The 28 CLE
on the Minolta CLE |
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These photographs try to give the best idea of the obstruction of the rangefinder : perfectly free with the 28 CLE, it is obviously out of order with the 50 f1. |
The 50 f 1 Noctilux
on the Minolta CLE :
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The opening of the CLE is not as wide as that of an M6: |
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The cell is located at the bottom on the Minolta CLE, a protective shroud baffle limits the free passage, preventing the mounting of the widest rear optical groups. |
Minolta CLE |
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The cell of the M6 is on the upper left corner (looking from front). This design leaves free passage for the largest rear optical groups. By the way, the position of the cell on the M6 origins a non-symetrical response of metering. Some differences in the shroud baffle of M6 are recorded, the last version being the widest. |
Leica M6 |
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Criteria to be taken to mount Leica M lenses on a Minolta CLE :
lenses provided with nondismountable spectacles. The best way of proceeding is to try to mount the lens on
a Minolta CLE without lens, of which shutter curtain is maintained open on long-time
exposure.
One sees the inner of the camera and thus can limit the risk of scratching the lens and/or the case (I slightly rubbed the rear
element of a 35 mm 1,4).
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| Late Leica M lenses on the CLE |
Lens | Part | Fitting | Frame | Obstruction | comment | tested | |
Wide lenses | |||||||
| 21 mm 2,8 | 11134 | yes | 28/90 | 1/4 | the sunshade blinds the rangefinder | no | |
| 21 mm 2,8 aspherical | 11135 | yes | 28/90 | 1/4 | the sunshade blocks the rangefinder | yes | |
| 24 mm 2,8 aspherical | 11878 | yes | ? | ? | size nearly as 21 mm asph - the whole viewer of CLE covers 24 mm | by Robert Jones | |
| 28 mm 2,8 old | 11804 | yes | 28/90 | 1/5 | correct - a little bulky | yes | |
| 28 mm 2,8 | 11809 | yes | 28/90 | 1/5 | correct - a little invading | yes | |
| 28 mm f 2 aspherical | 11604 | yes | ? | 1/8 | nearly perfect | by Double Expo | |
| 35 mm 1,4 old | 11870 | no | / | / | impossible to fit | yes | |
| 35 mm 1,4 aspherical | 11874 | yes | 40 | 1/4 | possible to use but defective | yes | |
| 35 mm f 2 (before 1980) | 11309 | yes | 28 | ? | possible to use but defective | no | |
| 35 mm f 2 | 11310 | no | / | / | impossible to fit | no | |
| 35 mm f 2 aspherical | 11879 | ? | ? | ? | ? | no | |
Standards | |||||||
| 50 mm f 2 old | 11819 | yes | 40 | 1/5 | possible to use but defective | yes | |
| 50 mm f 2 new | 11819 | yes | 40 | 1/5 | possible to use but defective | yes | |
| 50 mm 1,4 | 11114 | yes | 40 | 1/4 | possible to use but defective | yes | |
| 50 mm f 1 new | 11822 | limit | 40 | 1/3 | focusing impossible | yes | |
Tele-photo lenses | |||||||
| 75 mm 1,4 | 11815 | yes | 40 | 1/4 | no adequate frame | yes | |
| 90 mm f 2 | 11136 | yes | 90 |
| just acceptable | no | |
| 90 mm f 2 apo | 11884 | ? | ? | ? | ? | no | |
| 90 mm 2,8 old | 11800 | yes | 90 | free | perfect | yes | |
| 90 mm 2,8 new | 11807 | yes | 90 | free | good | yes | |
| 135 mm 2,8 | 11829 | to avoid | / | / | spectacles rub while | yes | |
| 135 mm f 4 | 11851 | hard to fit | 90 | free | correct - no adequate frame | yes | |
| 135 mm 3,4 apo | 11889 | ? | ? | ? | ? | no | |
Varifocal | |||||||
| 28/35/50 mm | 11890 | ? | ? |
| ? | no | |
Complement | |||||||
| Visoflex 3 | 16498 | yes | ? | / | withdraw viewing hood | yes | |
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Old Leica M lenses on the CLE |
Warning : I reproduce a table of semi-official Minolta information. I did not test myself.
Lenses | Part | Fitting | Frame | Obstruction | comment | ||
Short lenses | |||||||
| 15 mm f 8 | 11003 | not | / | / | impossible to fit | ||
| 21 mm f 4 | SUMOM | yes | 28/40 | ? | possible - no adequate frame | ||
| 21 mm f 3,4 | 11103 | yes | 28/40 | ? | possible - no adequate frame | ||
| 28 mm 2,8 old | 11804 | yes | 28/90 | yes | correct - invaded sight | ||
Standards | |||||||
| 50 mm 1,5 | SOMIA | yes | 40 | yes | no adequate frame | ||
Tele-photo lenses | |||||||
| 90 mm 2,8 old | 11129 | yes | 90 | a little | correct | ||
| 90 mm f 4 | 11540 | yes | 90 | free | correct | ||
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Lenses | Part | Fitting | Frame | Obstruction | comment | ||
Table to supplement with some of these lenses | |||||||
| / | / | / | / | / | / | ||
| / | / | / | / | / | / | ||
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Leica CL and Rokkor CLE lenses on the Leica M cameras |
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The Leica CL and Rokkor CLE lenses are mounted without any mechanical obstacle on the Leica M bodies.
On an M6, a 28 mm CLE projects the 35/135mm frames, the 40 CLE projects 50/75 mm frames and the 90 user is happy to see the 28/90 mm frames. This may be modified by a repair man, by a recess on the cam of the lens, but the so modified lens will no more project the correct frame on a CLE body ...
Since the full viewer of the M6 is approximately 28 mm, the 28 CLE was a good choice with it instead of former Leica M 28 which were a little weak until the 11804 included. The last 28 mm Leica exceeds head and shoulders the CLE, which I keep from now on in a box. At the 2000' Photokina a new 28 mm f2 has been introduced, advertised as even better. |
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On the Leica CL: fitting retractable Leica M lenses. |
Warning : I only mention Leica information. I did not test myself.
| Retractable lenses
To avoid damaging the mobile arm carrying the cell of the Leica CL, these optics must be provided on the sliding part
of the barrel with an adhesive tape (of old Dymo kind) limiting their retraction in the body.
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| Lenses impossible to mount
The Elmarit 28 mm F 2,8 before number 2314921 and the Super-Angulon 21 mm can't be used on the Leica CL, nor the 90 mm f 2, 135 mm f 4 and 50 mm f 1. But the Summilux 35 mm f 1,4 (which doesn't fit the Minolta CLE) can be used on the Leica CL. |
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Leica lenses chronological table |
Leica data | ||||||||||
Year | From | To | Year | From |
To | Année |
From | To | ||
1962 | 1913001 | 1967100 | 1971 | 2468501 | 2503100 | 1980 | 3013601 | 3087000 | ||
1963 | 1967101 | 2015700 | 1972 | 2503101 | 2556500 | 1981 | 3087001 | 3160500 | ||
1964 | 2015701 | 2077500 | 1973 | 2556501 | 2663400 | 1982 | 3160501 | 3249100 | ||
1965 | 2077501 | 2156300 | 1974 | 2663401 | 2731900 | 1983 | 3249101 | 3294900 | ||
1966 | 2156301 | 2236500 | 1975 | 2731901 | 2761100 | 1984 | 3294901 | 3346200 | ||
1967 | 2236501 | 2254400 | 1976 | 2761101 | 2809400 | 1985 | 3346201 | 3383200 | ||
1968 | 2254401 | 2312750 | 1977 | 2809401 | 2880600 | 1986 | 3383201 | 3422890 | ||
1969 | 2312751 | 2384700 | 1978 | 2880601 | 2967200 | 1987 | 3422891 | 3455870 | ||
1970 | 2384701 | 2468500 | 1979 | 2967201 | 3013600 | 1988 | 3455871 | ? | ||
| An approximate list based on marketed items | ||||||||||
1989 | 3480000 | 3505000 | 1994 | 3645000 | 3680000 | 1999 | 3825000 | 3860000 | ||
1990 | 3505000 | 3540000 | 1995 | 3680000 | 3730000 | 2000 | 3860000 | 3900000 | ||
1991 | 3540000 | 3585000 | 1996 | 3730000 | 3760000 | 2001 | 3900000 | 3950000 | ||
1992 | 3585000 | 3610000 | 1997 | 3760000 | 3790000 | 2002 | 3950000 |
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1993 | 3610000 | 3645000 | 1998 | 3790000 | 3825000 | 2003 |
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If you have any info on last years, please e.mail me
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Leica cameras chronological table |
Leica data | ||||||||||
Year | From | To | Year | From | To | Year | From | To | ||
1962 | 1037000 | 1065200 | 1970 | 1248200 | 1267500 | 1978 | 1470000 | 1502000 | ||
1963 | 1067501 | 1091000 | 1971 | 1267500 | 1289000 | 1979 | 1502000 | 1527200 | ||
1964 | 1091001 | 1102900 | 1972 | 1289000 | 1345500 | 1980 | 1527200 | 1543000 | ||
1965 | 1102901 | 1136500 | 1973 | 1345500 | 1375000 | 1981 | 1543000 | 1564000 | ||
1966 | 1136501 | 1164865 | 1974 | 13750800 | 1386700 | 1982 | 1564000 | 1604000 | ||
1967 | 1164866 | 1185000 | 1975 | 1386700 | 1443000 | 1983 | 1604000 | 1637500 | ||
1968 | 1185001 | 1205000 | 1976 | 1443000 | 1449000 | 1984 | 1637500 | 1664000 | ||
1969 | 1205000 | 1248500 | 1977 | 1449000 | 1470000 | 1985 | 1664000 | 1682000 | ||
| An approximate list based on marketed items | ||||||||||
1986 | 1682000 | ? | 1992 | ? | ? | 1998 | ? | ? | ||
1987 | ? | ? | 1993 | ? | ? | 1999 | ? | ? | ||
1988 | ? | ? | 1994 | ? | ? | 2000 | ? | 2470000 | ||
1989 | ? | ? | 1995 | ? | ? | 2001 | ? | ? | ||
1990 | ? | ? | 1996 | 2150000 | ? | 2002 | 2760000 |
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1991 | ? | ? | 1997 | ? | 2250000 | 2003 |
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| Serial numbers of Leica CL : |
| Leica CL 1973/1974 : 1300001 - 1335000 1974/1975 : 1395001 - 1410000 et 1975/1976 : 1425001 - 1440000 (65000 have been made) |
| Some special bodies : |
| M2 lacked in black 1962 : 1053101 - 1053250 1964 : 1093501 - 1093750 1965 : 1130001 - 1130300 and 1968 : 1207000 (only one) (total 701) |
| M3 lacked in black 1962 : 1059850 - 1059999 1964 : 1097701 - 1097850 1965 : 1134001 - 1134150 - and 1966 : 1157591 - 1157600 (total 460) |
| M4 lacked in black 1968 : 1207001 - 1207480 1969 : 1225001 - 1225800 1969/70 : 1246201 - 1248100 1970/71 : 1266001 - 1266100 1970 : 1266132 -1267100 - and 1971 : 1286201 - 1286700 (total 4749) |
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Leica bookmarks |
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Camera Quest Classics Camera by Stephen Gandy, a repairg man : a lot of pages, of which a bunch on Leica, Minolta CLE and other RF cameras. Documented and self experienced, a bit opinionated. |
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Leica papers by Erwin Puts, guru of Leica lenses testing Hologon 16 mm - Heliar 15 mm by Godfrey DiGiorgi, and other good material on his site (Minox etc..) |
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Leica : the site was easier to navigate before its relooking during the 2000' summer. Choose "publications" and then "product information" to get the page dedicated to the uploading of litterature. |
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| © D. Césari - Last update 5 - 21 - 2002 |